INTRODUCTION
Please can you start by introducing yourselves
Tim Banks (Chonburi FC) : I’m Tim Banks age 60. I live in Bangsaen and I am a retired Aviation Consultant.
Brian Millington (Oldham Athletic) : I’m Brian Millington, 57, resident of Royton, a small village just in Oldham. I am a Self Employed Accountant, married to a nurse with 4 children 25,23,20 and 16.
How long have you been a fan of your club?
TB : 3 years.
BM : I have been following Oldham Athletic for over 50 years.
Why did you become a fan of your club?
TB : After moving full time to Bangsaen I was eager to get involved with a football club and living in the midst of “Sharks” territory there was only going to be one club to support.
BM : I started by going with friends and their parents whilst at Hathershaw Junior School in Oldham.
How many home and away games do you attend each season?
TB : As a season ticket holder, I go to all the home games. I also attend 50% of away matches, mainly most of the Bangkok and Chonburi regional games
BM : I attend every home game and almost all away games with number two daughter Sarah age 23.
SEASON TICKETS
How long have you been a season ticket holder?
TB : This will be my third season.
BM : I have been a season ticket holder for over ten years -
Why did you become a season ticket holder?
TB : Ease of booking, obtaining a regular seat with an excellent position in the main double-decker grandstand and being amongst a group of like minded Sharks fans.
BM : When I became able to attend every game again - the joys of kids preventing this prior to then!!
How much does your season ticket cost and how much does this work out at per match?
TB : With no AFC Cup Group stage involvement this season, it is reduced from the previous two seasons to 3,500 Thai baht. With 17 home league games and no AFC involvement it works out to be 205 Thai baht per match, although replica shirts have been included in season ticket prices previously so the per match price will definitely reduce, although we are unaware of the final inclusive package for the forthcoming season, i. e are there replica shirts/leisure shirts, books etc? However, the 10% discount in the club shops remains. Are the club going to also include FA Cup and League Cup home matches within the package, which were excluded previously?
BM : My season ticket costs £ 328.00 (B16,000), which is about £ 14.00 (B685) per game.
What is the regular admission price?
TB : 200 Thai baht in the main grandstand. It varies between B80-B150 elsewhere in the stadium.
BM : The normal match day price is £19.00 (B930) pre paid or £ 20.00 (B978) on the day.
What benefits do you get as a season ticket holder?
TB : Priority booking for all matches including AFC Knock out stage matches and both domestic Cup competitions, (although I believe these should be in the overall package) Season ticket renewal gifts and importantly choice of seat and the facility to renew the same seat thereafter. Plus 10% discount on Chonburi F.C merchandise in the club shop and various other marketing incentives throughout the season.
BM : Benefits of a season ticket are many: You look forward to Saturday (it all goes to pot at 4.45p.m.). You have your own seat along with friends, you are assured of FA Cup tickets - I have mine for Liverpool (Oldham have drawn the Merseyside club at home in the 4th Round of the FA Cup). You get discount in the club shop and you have the chance to bring a friend for a fiver (B240)!!!!
What would you say to fellow fans to encourage them to become season ticket holders?
TB : All clubs need the bulk of their monies up front to be able to administer a budget and plan accordingly and Chonburi is no different in that respect. I believe that fans want to sit with their friends on a regular basis and if you do not utilise the season ticket facility this becomes less likely as our stadium is one of only a few in Thailand that has individual and numbered seats. We also have an electronic booking facility, whereas many clubs still have stadiums with “slab concrete terraces” that whilst enabling many more fans to be accommodated, without specific individual seating and just tickets for zones, this does cause serious issues regarding unsafe overcrowding at various big matches throughout the season, especially for visiting fans.
BM : I would tell my mates that a season ticket is good value and that every match watching Oldham is a rollercoaster ride - the problem is ALL my friends are closet United and City fans and spend their money on Sky T V and a slab of Lager!!
MATCHDAY ROUTINE (HOME)
Who do you usually travel to the match with?
Tim Banks (Chonburi FC) : I travel to home games alone - as I live only a very short distance from the stadium - prior to meeting with a regular group of ex-pat fans.
Brian Millington (Oldham Athletic) : We live in Royton about 1.5 miles away from the ground. Sarah and I walk to home games with a stop at the bookies to give them my hard earned cash with a bet on Oldham and a five fold bet on 5 league one games. (the first week of this season we won £ 510 for £ 5!!!) We tend to stop outside the ground for a chat with other friends who sit in different stands to us.
What is your usual matchday routine for a home game?
TB : Our group of ex pats meets at a Sala in the park behind the away end, about two hours before kick-off, where we have access to all the usual food and drink. Whereas all these are currently banned in the stadium itself, which continues to be a “huge bone of contention”
BM : We use the same turnstile each week buying a programme and "strike it lucky" ticket from the same vendors.
Do you buy a programme at the match and how much does it cost?
TB : All season ticket holders are given their “free” programme as they enter into the stadium via their designated gateways. They cost 20 Thai baht for non season ticket holders.
BM : The programme is £ 3 (B146) and Sarah reads it at half time, I take it home to read in bed!!
Do you buy food and drink at the ground?
TB : As mentioned I purchase my food and drinks via the street vendors alongside the entrance to the stadium but not via the club sponsor vendors situated inside the stadium confines.
BM : Being the second highest league ground in the UK and being on the Pennines we tend to buy a pie at 50% of the games and a hot Bovril at 100% of the games.
How much does food and drink at the stadium cost, and how do these prices compare with the same food bought elsewhere?
TB : Via the street vendors 3 cans of beer (primarily Leo & Chang) currently cost 100 Thai baht but at certain times promotions with Chang, a club sponsor, will sometimes price 4 beers for B100. Food wise ten chicken pieces and chips cost 40 Thai baht and various sausages, chicken and typical Thai snacks would cost between 20-40 Thai baht and soft drinks would be priced between B10-20.
The street vendor prices are about the same throughout the city, excluding the Bangsaen beachfront, although certain beers (Singha) are in scarce supply as they cost more for the vendor to obtain so choice is reasonably limited
BM : Pies are £ 2.60 (B127) and hot drinks are £ 1.60 (B78). To me these are very expensive in comparison to outside the ground. (Two pies for £ 1 (B48) at the shop in Royton)
Are you allowed to take food and drink, including alcohol, to your seat?
TB : After a couple of match day incidents in 2011 versus Buriram PEA (which we were correctly sanctioned with having to play 3 games behind closed doors) ALL food and drink is currently banned from inside the stadium. Whereas I would understand perhaps beer being banned from some high profile full house matches, to ban all food and drink is draconian and has led to considerable fall out and various season ticket holders threatening not to renew for the coming season. Not allowing water into the stadium is actually a health hazard, with the temperatures still in the 30’s at kick off.
There is not a standard policy throughout the Thai Premier League and each club dictates what can be allowed inside their grounds. Chonburi undobtedly has the toughest zero tolerance policy, which is completely “ over the top” in my honest opinion and this continues to be hotly debated as we approach the new season
BM : We sit in The Chadderton Road Stand (Chaddy End) although no alcohol is served in our stand it is in the other two. We tend to take the food to our seat to watch the team warm up pre match. After the game we drown our sorrows, or raise a glass to the team in The Railway Hotel in Royton - J W Lees Bitter £ 2.65 (B130) a pint!!
Who do you sit with inside the stadium?
TB : I sit with the webmaster and a regular group of ex-pats, numbering between 6-10. These are primarily Thai based English and German football fans.
BM : We sit with 3 or 4 friends we have made at football,
How do you feel you are treated at the stadium and how does this affect your matchday experience?
TB : Poorly, as stated above, due to this zero tolerance policy and certainly compared to other grounds we visit and with such a tough policy the security staff are therefore particularly offensive in adhering to the rules etc and add nothing but negative vibes to the match day experience
There is a groundswell that the fans enjoy the away games more than the home games, which is surely an indictment of the clubs ill advised policy and their undoubted over reaction to incidents that have been blown out of all proportion. We have already been punished for these incidents. In fact, the season ticket holders came off worst, as we were banned from attending three home matches that we'd already paid for.
The view is excellent from the main double decker stand and the individual seats comfortable, although the lack of exits would cause UK Health and Safety a seizure!
In my opinion, the atmosphere is lacking at the new stadium, and doesn't come close to equalling that generated on the concrete slabs at the old IPE Stadium. However, at the away games, especially the big ones, it is sensational and memories of Muang Thong away at Christmas 2011 remind me of what a fantastic away following the club has. Sadly with the individual seating and therefore a more splintered group of supporters and perhaps a new breed of fans the noise level and commitment at home games, is not as good as it could be.
As regards the overall match day experience, the management have got their match day policies so wrong (compared to the other top sides in the TPL) that it could have major repercussions this season in season ticket renewals and it will be key whether they relax the policy in the advent of such massive criticisms on all fronts.
BM : There is little or no police presence and we know the stewards in our stand (Sarah's future husband is one!!) We enjoy the day, the view is good (there are posts in our stand) but being a small club there is a great friendly atmosphere as we are all behind the team.
How easy is it to mix with rival fans before and after the match?
TB : Pretty easy and enjoyable, especially as we base ourselves at the Sala in the park at the “away” end of the stadium. With the exception of a couple of games where the police cordoned off the whole of the visitors/away end - shades of the UK - but fortunately that has passed and there is a good banter with our rivals and ex-pats supporters are always in demand for photos with the visiting fans.
MB : With crowd segregation and not going to the pub before a home game we don't get to mix with the away fans at home games which is sad really as we are all football fans at heart.
MATCHDAY ROUTINE (AWAY)
Who do you usually travel to away matches with?
Tim Banks (Chonburi FC) : The webmaster and various members of the group of ex pat fans.
Brian Millington (Oldham Athletic) : Most away game are with Sarah, my daughter, although we sometimes travel with two friends Ian and Kenny. We tend to have one or two away games where we stay away for the weekend and visit the local area - Crawley and Nottingham so far this season.
What is your usual routine for an away match?
TB : I usually travel in private cars to the more local games with the webmaster or various members of the ex pat group and use the official supporters bus on longer trips, when my job is to bring the refreshments/sweets etc.
BM : Most away games are south of us and the deal is I buy the match tickets (in advance as they are cheaper) although some games are pay on the day. Sarah drives and buys the petrol and uses her car. I navigate and as we have been going to games for so long, we don't even take a sat-nav or map!!
Do you ever travel on the club’s official transport?
TB : Yes, the supporters bus that departs from SriRacha actually picks me up at the end of my road, although timing is very much by Thai time and can vary by up to 30-45 minutes from the original pick up time.
BM : Once a season we have a break and use the official coach - it's a chance to chat to some people we only ever see at away games. The club manages to fill one 52 seat coach for each away game. Most people travel by car or train.
How much does it usually cost?
TB : Obviously it varies according to the destination but a mean average would between 250-350 Thai baht.
BM : In my view it's overpriced at £ 25 (B1,210) for games in the London area. Hence the limited use of it!!
How do you rate the experience of travelling on the official transport?
TB : Excellent, as the regular bus is a double decker luxury one with all the facilities and the added advantage of a very good and safe driver.
BM : Travel by coach is slow - 60mph (96kmph) at the most - and with a 30 minute break every 3 hours.
Do you buy a programme at away games?
TB : No, as I do not read Thai and few have any pages with English content.
BM : I don't tend to buy a programme at away grounds.
Do you buy food and drink at away grounds?
TB : Yes, same as at our home matches with prices roughly the same, although perhaps slightly cheaper at the more provincial grounds. We can also buy alcohol and soft drinks inside stadiums - served in plastic glasses or plastic bags - elsewhere throughout the TPL, so I’ll often have a beer.
BM : For most away games we know of a good pub for a pre match drink for me (Sarah drives thus doesn't drink - happy days) and we visit ones with real ale and food. We quite often bump into fellow Oldham fans in these pubs! It’s funny but I don't tend to drink alcohol at away grounds, just in the pub prior to the game, but I will have a Bovril (a hot beef drink) or a coffee.
Are you allowed to take food and drink to your seat?
TB : Yes, in pretty much all stadiums in the TPL, although it must be in plastic glasses.
BM : Most grounds allow food and drink (but NOT alcohol) to be consumed at your seat.
What is the cheapest and most expensive away ticket you’ve bought this season?
TB : 100 Thai Baht at the League Cup match against Customs Utd was the cheapest, although I understand that they’d put their prices up from 80 baht just for our visit. The most expensive was at Muang Thong, when they were 150 Thai baht for the league match.
BM : Away admission prices this season have been as low as £ 10 (B484) - Nottingham Forest - and as high as £ 25 (B1,210) - MK Dons and Hartlepool (last season) - but they average out at about £ 20.00 (B968)
Generally, how do you feel you are treated at away grounds?
TB : Very well indeed and I thoroughly enjoy all the away games, although the high profile ones at Buriram and Muang Thong United have to be policed slightly differently. I fully understand this, as with 20,000 plus fans filling the grounds to capacity, safety is a concern.
BM : I do like away games better than home games. In League One everyone is friendly, the away fans, the stewards, the police and I find the atmosphere to be better.
How easy is it to mix with rival fans before and after the match?
TB : Excluding the two teams mentioned earlier with their huge attendances, it is very easy to mingle and share a beer and/or food with rival fans. We ex-pats are seen as a bit of a curiosity and I would guess we have our photos taken with the home fans on average about 3 or 4 times each match.
BM : Sarah tends to wear a Latics top to away games and this gets us into conversation with fans from the home club. Most fans are passionate about their club and to me the banter with the opposition fans is a highlight of the day.
Please give one example of a positive experience at an away game and one example of a negative experience?
TB : This was an example of the difference between home and away attitudes and a positive experience occurred at the end of last season in Saraburi, the home of Osotspa. I was mistakenly allowed into the grandstand with some cans of beer, which were then taken from me by a security guard. However, he returned a couple of minutes later with two large plastic glasses, some ice and my “missing” beer. He then proceeded to serve it to me this “brought the house down” especially compared to the treatment we receive at our home stadium.
An unfortunate negative was at the Leo Stadium, the home of Bangkok Glass. The stewards ignored our initial pleas to open the empty centre section between the rival fans even though it was obvious to everyone that our section was completely oversold and was becoming unsafe. Fortunately, good sense did prevail, as it was opened shortly afterwards.
BM : Positive points to away games are at some smaller grounds (Yeovil and Dagenham), where home and away fans are in the same stand and you can have the banter. A negative experience would be at Sheffield Wednesday a few seasons ago. Quite a nasty game of football and then at the end 18,000 fans - both Oldham & Sheffield - were leaving the ground through the same small opening. Some of the Sheffield fans were not friendly, to say the least!
Which is your favourite away trip and why?
TB : Muang Thong, because the atmosphere at a full SCG Stadium is excellent and the football is always some of the best on show in the TPL. We always seem to take at least 20 buses and overfill our visitors allocation by 50% and until this last season, it was a fairly happy hunting ground for us.
BM : My most enjoyable away trip is Carlisle United . Not for the football, but for the scenery on the trip up there, the Lune Gorge and Shap Fell in the Lake District are awesome; the traffic is very light on the motorway going to Carlisle; we always go into Scotland to Gretna before the match as there is the most fantastic fish and chip shop in the village.
What do you enjoy most about travelling to away games?
TB : The camaraderie and the banter and the ability to visit far flung Provinces throughout the TPL and as I expressed earlier the away support is 100% committed and a credit to the club and I know the players and owner are really thankful for the masses that follow the team.
BM : Visiting different parts of the country, meeting fellow Oldham fans in far flung places and enjoying the banter with the home supporters.
What don’t you enjoy about travelling to away games?
TB : Losing and the prospect of a four hour plus coach journey through Sunday night traffic.
BM : The only downside to away games, in the UK in winter, is after the game, (more so if we have lost) is travelling home in the cold, dark, over crowded motorway for 4 or 5 hours. Although with Sarah's choice in “yagga gagga ding dong” music, I can hold my own with anyone in conversation about modern pop groups and singers.
GENERAL
How do ticket prices compare with other forms of entertainment in your area?
Tim Banks (Chonburi FC): Season tickets are slightly more expensive but general ticket prices within the ground compare to other forms of local entertainment.
Brian Millington (Oldham Athletic): I think football is overpriced - although Sarah has just paid £ 80 (B3,828) to watch The Lion King at the theatre.
Roughly, how much do you spend in a season following your club?
TB : 17,000-20,000 Thai baht
BM : With Sarah's tickets, travel, the odd pie and a pint or two, I would say £ 60 (B2,870) per home game and £ 100 (B4,785) per away game. I would hate my wife to work out what I spend following the Super Blues.
How do you feel that your club regards you as a fan and how much of an affinity do you feel with the players, coaches and management?
TB : As I outlined previously I feel that the club in general is unfortunately becoming more distant from the fans, as it grows. This is a worrying trend that has to be arrested. There is certainly a good rapport with the players who really enjoy the away support in particular, with the regulars travelling all over Thailand, although very little with the current coaches who seem very unapproachable. Again the relationships with the management could be so much better, although transparency and communication are areas that need addressing throughout Thai life and not just at football clubs.
BM : There is a family atmosphere at the club. This season whilst buying things in the club shop two players stopped for a chat and whilst collecting some tickets Simon Corney - Club Owner and Chairman also stopped for a chat saying he sees Sarah and me at most away games.
Do you ever attend club organised functions?
TB : I usually go to the start of season party and promotions at Central shopping mall, such as the pre season kit launch.
BM : I tend to stay away from any organised functions as they are in my opinion, overpriced. I did go to a Meet the Players at a dog racing night but there were problems there with a couple of players who, shall we say, "enjoyed a drink".
Do you think your club organise enough of these functions?
TB : No, they need to organise more of these in order to gauge feedback from the backbone of the club and digest what these fans think and want.
BM : No I don't think they do, apart from the end of season awards, that's about it. There are a few meet the player/manager events, but not enough!
What type of functions would you like to see the club organise?
TB : A regular schedule of events throughout the season underwritten partially by club sponsors and published well in advance with some events held to coincide with Youth matches to encourage the fans to support the Chonburi FC of tomorrow.
BM : More social events based around the club to get everyone, players, youth players, backroom staff and management together to communicate how people see the club and what if anything could be done to improve the match day experience etc.
Does your club give you the opportunity to make your feelings known on relevant matters?
TB : I do not believe so as again it is not the “Thai way”. Although I feel that it should start with a comprehensive questionnaire to be completed when you fill in your season ticket application. They could extend this idea to include non season ticket holders and club members. I also think that there should be an end of season questionnaire and much better use of the club’s website for the Thai fans feedback throughout the year. Although I believe the General Manager is a regular online visitor to the English Chonburi F.C. independent website and would be able to gauge feedback accordingly, as the webmaster is very fair and impartial in his coverage, whilst being a true committed Shark.
BM : You can contact the club by e-mail and they do respond, although not always in the way you would anticipate. I think they could do more for the fans including keeping them better informed.
Name one thing, not playing related, your club has done that has given you a nice warm glow?
TB : Travelling to my wife’s province in Phitsanulok and Petchabun to play two games back to back over one weekend to raise money for those suffering from flood damage.
BM : High point of the last few years was last season at Hartlepool, on a wet, cold winter Tuesday night. After the game the manager Paul Dickoff came over to the away stand and shook the hand of each and every travelling supporter - all 79 of us!!
Name one thing your club has done, again not playing related, that has made you go “grrr”?
TB : I repeat my dismay at the banning of all drinks/foodstuffs in the stadium and the negative impact that this has on the fans. Also the need recently to change the club logo, when the old one is seen everywhere throughout the region. This obviously means that all merchandise needs changing and the higher costs associated will impact on the fans.
BM : What don't I like about the club - they should have left the club badge alone - the new design of Owl is awful!!!!!!!!!!!
Anything else you’d like to add?
TB : The club has made huge strides since its formation, especially in the last couple of years as a visit to the ground would testify and they should be rightly congratulated. However, I would caution it against continued growth and expansion if this alienates the fans, and the club in general loses touch with its supporters which, in my honest opinion, is beginning to be the case.
All the froth and marketing is very well but the club's heart is its supporters and there is a great deal of discontent which is illustrated by the fact that regulars of 5/6 years ago, when the club had very little compared to the present day, no longer attend. And those reasons why are paramount in ensuring that the club does go forward but with their fan base in tact and 100% on side.
BM : I love my football and my club and you can't beat the match day atmosphere. I am off to the pub for my Sunday afternoon pint and today I will have to put up with "Armchair" City and United fans as they are both on TV. My mate Gary "supports" United, he will have the shirt on but has never been to Old Trafford - it's only 8 miles (13kms) away for goodness sake. If I can make Crawley - 225 miles (362kms) - why can't he do 8?!!
I rest my case.
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